Another School Shooting... I guess thoughts and prayers aren't working.

[ekelon]

If you want to see an example of America with better gun laws under democratic rule, take a look at Chicago...which has the strictest gun laws in America...who also has a Democratic senator...

[Ansel]

In 1996 Australia had it's worst mass shooting in history. Soon after, the prime minister made a gun ban. One third of the country's arsenal was bought back and destroyed. Since then there has not been a mass shooting. Should America follow the same path?

[Wreckless]

He broke the no murdering law but maybe he would have behaved if there was a no guns for retards law.

[ekelon]

In 1996 Australia had it's worst mass shooting in history. Soon after, the prime minister made a gun ban. One third of the country's arsenal was bought back and destroyed. Since then there has not been a mass shooting. Should America follow the same path?

That’s why some evil people plowed through crowds of people last year there...

If someone had a gun on them, they could have saved lives

[Ansel]

That’s why some evil people plowed through crowds of people last year there...

If someone had a gun on them, they could have saved lives

[ekelon]

I don’t get what’s funny?

Are you saying a gun is more dangerous than a car?

[Robin Williams]

That’s why some evil people plowed through crowds of people last year there...

If someone had a gun on them, they could have saved lives

So let's get this straight, you think it's a good idea for someone in a crowd of people to open fire. Retard.

[ekelon]

So let's get this straight, you think it's a good idea for someone in a crowd of people to open fire. Retard.

At a vehicle plowing through pedestrians while the driver screams allhu akbar...

yes

[Robin Williams]

Majority of gun related deaths are suicide.

Of that majority an overwhelming number are White Males.

The use of guns in peoples homes shows that self defense is virtually non-existent compared to the other ways guns are used. Of those ways, unintentional shootings, criminal assaults/homicides, and attempted/completed suicides are the vast majority of use.

In Japan they banned any non-soldiers from having swords, this resulted in less homicides. Then they banned guns from any non-soldiers and hunters. They also prohibited hunters from selling their guns. All this back in the late 1600s, and now Japan is one of the countries with the least amount of gun violence and homicide.

In Korea instead of high gun crime rates they have a high number of stabbings. However we see something that should be obvious, there is far less people killed in the same amount of knife violence as gun violence. This means one thing that should be obvious, it's easier to kill people with guns.

[Robin Williams]

At a vehicle plowing through pedestrians while the driver screams allhu akbar...

yes

If a vehicle is going 30-60+ mph and ramming through people, and you have enough training to react to this situation, then of the shots you fire how sure can you be you'll hit the guy in the head, and if you do then how does that stop the vehicle? It will continue plowing through people, all you've done is murdered a person before they could but put through due process.

Instead of thinking guns will magically solve problems, how about you figure out how YOU are going to solve the problem first. A gun in the hands of the incompetent and frail is like giving a toddler a knife.

[ekelon]

That’s why normal people tend to focus on mental health issues instead of gun laws after a tragedy Robin...because...you know...a mentally insane person will kill no matter what he has...

The above “research” you posted pretty much points to:

To end gun related deaths, end freedom in America.

[ekelon]

Robin let me put you in these situations

You’re a teacher at a daycare. 30 kids lives are in your hands. A guy comes in and kills everyone including you. Ban guns?

or

You’re home with your child throwing him a birthday party with 29 other kids there and a dude breaks in with a gun and you kill him, saving all of the kids. Keep guns?

Both are realistically capable of happening right now at this very minute...because of freedom...

[Robin Williams]

That’s why normal people tend to focus on mental health issues instead of gun laws after a tragedy Robin...because...you know...a mentally insane person will kill no matter what he has...

The above “research” you posted pretty much points to:

To end gun related deaths, end freedom in America.

If I give a kid some money to buy whatever he wants, and we put a gumball machine in his room. How many people honestly think he's not going to spend his money on a gumball? Now what if we gave that same kid a .44 magnum instead. We tell him he's only to use it to protect himself. He gets a little older and has an existential crisis. He presently wants to kill himself, in that moment he remember he has a gun. Now how many people honestly think he's not going to kill himself? Kids like candy, suicidal people want change. The most accessible and easiest option for change is obviously killing yourself. According to statistics, that seems to be the case. Majority use of guns in house holds is not self defense, it's suicide followed by criminal action, homicide, and unintentional shootings.

I'm not a psychologist but I know if I have a piece of chocolate cake in my refrigerator I'm more likely to wake up in the middle of the night and go eat it, than I am to stay in bed if I had not had the cake in there in the first place. Why would this be any different for guns? The school shooting that happen recently I believe could of been avoided had that kid not have the weapon in the first place. I believe in majority of school shootings specifically, if they did not have access to a weapon they would not of committed the action. It's a lot harder to build up the confidence to go stab all your friends at school than it is to load a clip into an AR15 and start pray'n'spraying their guts over the walls. Not to mention it's a lot harder to kill a few dozen people with a knife than it is a gun. I believe this to be true for almost all gun related deaths. Suicide or homicide, both could be somewhat prevented and lessened greatly if a Gun was never in the picture.


Now I understand right wingers ideological outlook on the right to own a 1700's flint lockrifle. It's more ideological than anything, at it's core it's saying we the people own our government. People are not compelled to do stuff by the government, the government is compelled to do stuff by the people. But in reality we aren't fighting a physical war against our government, we don't need to and don't have the resources to defend against the US government if they wanted to just send soldiers to our houses to cuck our wifes with automatic machine guns pointed at our faces. That's not going to happen because we've advanced past that, the government will do things to oppress us in much more subtle ways that can't be fought against with a gun. So I find that ideological concept right wingers hold to be stupid. Wanting to give your citizens power is great, but wanting to give them all samurai swords, guns, nukes, etc.. is stupid and counteractive to the reason government exists, because people are stupid and require imaginary constructs to promote fear and order in their hearts for them to act like civilized people.

[ekelon]

If I give a kid some money to buy whatever he wants, and we put a gumball machine in his room. How many people honestly think he's not going to spend his money on a gumball? Now what if we gave that same kid a .44 magnum instead. We tell him he's only to use it to protect himself. He gets a little older and has an existential crisis. He presently wants to kill himself, in that moment he remember he has a gun. Now how many people honestly think he's not going to kill himself? Kids like candy, suicidal people want change. The most accessible and easiest option for change is obviously killing yourself. According to statistics, that seems to be the case. Majority use of guns in house holds is not self defense, it's suicide followed by criminal action, homicide, and unintentional shootings.

I'm not a psychologist but I know if I have a piece of chocolate cake in my refrigerator I'm more likely to wake up in the middle of the night and go eat it, than I am to stay in bed if I had not had the cake in there in the first place. Why would this be any different for guns? The school shooting that happen recently I believe could of been avoided had that kid not have the weapon in the first place. I believe in majority of school shootings specifically, if they did not have access to a weapon they would not of committed the action. It's a lot harder to build up the confidence to go stab all your friends at school than it is to load a clip into an AR15 and start pray'n'spraying their guts over the walls. Not to mention it's a lot harder to kill a few dozen people with a knife than it is a gun. I believe this to be true for almost all gun related deaths. Suicide or homicide, both could be somewhat prevented and lessened greatly if a Gun was never in the picture.


Now I understand right wingers ideological outlook on the right to own a 1700's flint lockrifle. It's more ideological than anything, at it's core it's saying we the people own our government. People are not compelled to do stuff by the government, the government is compelled to do stuff by the people. But in reality we aren't fighting a physical war against our government, we don't need to and don't have the resources to defend against the US government if they wanted to just send soldiers to our houses to cuck our wifes with automatic machine guns pointed at our faces. That's not going to happen because we've advanced past that, the government will do things to oppress us in much more subtle ways that can't be fought against with a gun. So I find that ideological concept right wingers hold to be stupid. Wanting to give your citizens power is great, but wanting to give them all samurai swords, guns, nukes, etc.. is stupid and counteractive to the reason government exists, because people are stupid and require imaginary constructs to promote fear and order in their hearts for them to act like civilized people.

That’s why when I decide to raise a family, I will teach morals...which seems to have been forgotten nowadays considering more and more parents are convinced that their child should be able to choose their own gender instead of naturally raising them and instilling morals to be a good human being. America was founded upon one thing...Freedom.

Being free is the ultimate privilege in life. You have laws based on morals and vice versa. Nobody has to tell you to not kill your dad. You know that. That’s why it solely lands in the parents/guardians hands when it comes to behaviors. Cruz killed 17 people, in a school he was kicked out of, with a gun. He had the option to kill himself but chose to be evil and take the lives of others. His parents/guardians should have noticed his behavior and contacted professional help. It wasn’t his fault his parents died, but it is his guardians responsibility to raise him. He had every sign you could think of to not be around guns. Why did his parents let him around them? The FBI was notified of his behavior on YouTube, and he was already identified because of his real name being his screen name.

He killed people with a gun. He could have killed the same and more with a vehicle, bomb, knife, etc... He had the right to freedom as do the rest of us and he chose to be evil. But to blame guns when the only way they are used is the person behind them is ignorant...because that same person (who can be banned from using a gun his whole life) can also operate a vehicle that can go anywhere he wants it to.

[Robin Williams]

That’s why when I decide to raise a family, I will teach morals...which seems to have been forgotten nowadays considering more and more parents are convinced that their child should be able to choose their own gender instead of naturally raising them and instilling morals to be a good human being. America was founded upon one thing...Freedom.

Being free is the ultimate privilege in life. You have laws based on morals and vice versa. Nobody has to tell you to not kill your dad. You know that. That’s why it solely lands in the parents/guardians hands when it comes to behaviors. Cruz killed 17 people, in a school he was kicked out of, with a gun. He had the option to kill himself but chose to be evil and take the lives of others. His parents/guardians should have noticed his behavior and contacted professional help. It wasn’t his fault his parents died, but it is his guardians responsibility to raise him. He had every sign you could think of to not be around guns. Why did his parents let him around them? The FBI was notified of his behavior on YouTube, and he was already identified because of his real name being his screen name.

He killed people with a gun. He could have killed the same and more with a vehicle, bomb, knife, etc... He had the right to freedom as do the rest of us and he chose to be evil. But to blame guns when the only way they are used is the person behind them is ignorant...because that same person (who can be banned from using a gun his whole life) can also operate a vehicle that can go anywhere he wants it to.

Here some things we agree on.


We should emphasize individuality

Everyone is responsible for themselves to some degree

Freedom is not a privileged it's an inherit right.



With that being said, I understand you are against banning guns, that's fine and there are plenty of reasons to feel that way. However you cannot ignore the facts about human behavior. Let me put it this way, I'd rather have a kid go to school stabbing people, than have him going to school shooting people. We do have a more social and psychological issue here, and that's our instinctive nature as animals. We have to understand if we give 100 people a gun to defend themselves, at least some of them are going to kill themselves and or others. Knowing that, we as a society should not enable these actions. One big way we enable it is by allowing them to have a weapon. Sure people can kill themselves and others with knives and cars, but it's not nearly as easy as it is with a gun.

We need to address the source of this problem, and one way to do so is constructing a better society. As I told you earlier, places like Japan established strict laws against use of weapons hundreds of years ago so their cultures weren't rvolving around it, and in places like korea where crime is higher, people use other things to attack each other, and it just so happens knives and such are a lot harder to kill people with than a semi-automatic is. However this does not mean we can ignore guns. Now I'll be real with you, the media is playing a big part in this trend because they show people it. Just like if a kid sees spongbob walk around saying "im ready" then imitate him, thats what all humans do. The media has continued to plant ideas into the heads of the disturbed further enabling and promoting these kind of actions. The left is utilizing the media's coverage of these stories to reinforce their narrative of banning guns. Then there is the vast majority of the population who genuinely want to uphold our basic constitutional rights, but don't want to enable people to do such things so easily.

So the only solution which is being ignored and shunned due to identity politics is to crack down on guns. One way to do so is to actually regulate what guns people can have, and make people who sell from individual to individual have to show paper work and have some sort of vetting process like in gun stores. At the very least force them to file it to the ATF, have gun counts and ammo counts. There are lots of things both the right and left would agree on that need to be in place, but it's all being drowned out by corporatist and lobbyists who stand to make a huge profit off this kind of shit. There is a reason why the NRA has spent so much on campaign contributions. They stand to make a profit while spreading narratives that cause people to be afraid to even talk about any kind of specific regulation. In fact the current modern political landscape has tried to make any kind of regulation appear to be a bad thing. It's absurd and this is really class warfare at it's finest. Get all the poor people rattled up with different political narratives so they can't talk about actual specifics on things, it becomes a non-substance shitshow of two grown men screaming at each other, but in a way that manages to make battlerap look somewhat entertaining.

As americans we cannot afford to keep talking so vaguely and broadly. We're not blaming guns, we're blaming humans just like you. We both agree it's humans fault for their actions, but we know the gun promotes them to do things, and it makes it easier for them to do things. We cannot expect everyone be close enough with their kids and raise them intelligently. All we can try to do is fix what we can, and the biggest thing we can fix is the lack of regulation on arms. The biggest thing we can't fix in the short term is human psychology.